CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay


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CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay

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Megatron
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Feb 24, 2018, 6:02 PM

Post #1 of 56 (3464 views)
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CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay	Can't Post

Regards,

I was trying to repair CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D with no sound and service diagnose mode say that the problem is "DOLBY". When I measured the voltages I accidentally shorted 5V and ground pin when measuring on audio PCB. The TV turned off and now when I want to turn on it is tickting something in the power supply but it is not relay, I measured voltage on RL801 relay coil and there is constant voltage on relay coil 7,5V when is tickting, the other relay RL802 is Dead because it is not coming signal from connector D2 pin 2. So the sound is not comming from relays, what could it be?

I have pulled out audio PCB from motherboard but the problem is still remaining. I accidentally shorted on DOLBY PCB on connector DP1 pin 6 (5V) with pin 5 (GND) probably, the problem still remain with pulled out audio PCB, the TV is clicking for 5 seconds and go back in standby mode and the red power on LED remains on. Clicking is twice faster then on car turn signal light.
What could couse this ticking sound, capacitor, MOSFET, chip ore something else?
Here is datasheet:
https://servlib.com/panasonic/tv/tx-32pg50.html

Thank you

(This post was edited by Megatron on Feb 24, 2018, 7:12 PM)

jts1957
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Feb 24, 2018, 9:08 PM

Post #2 of 56 (3456 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

B-plus present at IC2706? Pin 1 & 2.

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Location: Far, Far Away

Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 12:22 AM

Post #3 of 56 (3452 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi JTS long time no see!:)
Just found Black smoke on power supply bord "D" on diode D855 after secondary of transformer. Heat sink of diode is Black of smoke but after testing on multimeter the diode shows normal behavior. It conducts in one way and in another way it doesn't conduct, but when I switch on diode tester sometimes it shows 396mV "BAD" and sometimes 400mV "GOOD". The limit on my diode tester between "BAD" and "GOOD" is 400mV. I don't Know now is the diode problem, but TV is not clicking any more, it is trying to switch on but it goes back to standby. I have also checked elements around diode and everything looks fine.
Diode is FMGG2CS TUC14767.

I'll check this pins 1 & 2 on IC2706.

jts1957
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Feb 25, 2018, 12:40 AM

Post #4 of 56 (3448 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Page 5 Confirm the voltages on the D Board.

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Location: Far, Far Away

Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 1:06 AM

Post #5 of 56 (3447 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

I have solder suspicious diode D855 again and test on IC2706 pins 1 & 2:

PIN1 on standby 0,6V and when turning on the TV while clicking 2,6V.

PIN2 on standby 210mV and when turning on the TV while clicking 0,6V.

(This post was edited by Megatron on Feb 25, 2018, 1:09 AM)

jts1957
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Feb 25, 2018, 2:32 AM

Post #6 of 56 (3442 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Presuming comma is a decimal point.

What about:

Quote

Page 5 Confirm the voltages on the D Board.

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Location: Far, Far Away

Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 5:09 AM

Post #7 of 56 (3440 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Removed on D board jumper JSD59 to see if klicking sound will stop, but it doesn't when diode D855 is on the board. That means that the problem is probably on the D bord. I'll measure all voltages as on page 4/5 and then write the results.

Yes decimal point number 0,6V zero point six volts.

(This post was edited by Megatron on Feb 25, 2018, 5:14 AM)

jts1957
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Feb 25, 2018, 6:17 AM

Post #8 of 56 (3438 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

JSD59 is 30V for Tuner.
Since you want to jump around, try floating Horiz. Output transistor's Collector (Q551) to see if quicking stops.

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Location: Far, Far Away

(This post was edited by jts1957 on Feb 25, 2018, 6:20 AM)

Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 7:30 AM

Post #9 of 56 (3437 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

I couldn't sleep so I measured like on page 5 on manual, the results are disaster:

A-board
A1 Pin2 7,5V (measured 7,5V) OK
A1 Pin12 -20V (-5V)
A1 Pin16 20V (2,1V)
A2 Pin15 30V (140mV)
A2 Pin6 15V (2,5V)
A3 Pin4 15V (0,8V)
A3 Pin2 -15V (140mV)

IC1252 Pin2 2,5V (2,4V) OK
IC125 Pin3 3,3V (3,3V) OK
IC3302 Pin3 12V (3mV)
IC2707 Pin3 8V (13,4mV)
L2707 (IC2708) 9V (1,4V)
L2704 (IC2706) 5V (0,6V)
L2716 (IC2705) 3,3V (150mV)
L2717 (IC2709) 3,3V (50mV)

D-board
TPD8-GND 7,5V (7,4V) OK
TPD9-TPD11 38,5V (7,1V)
TPD10-GND 15,5V (0,7V)
TPD13-GND 14,5V (2,5V)
TPD15-GND 144,8V (22V)
TPD32-GND 209V (18V)
C864-GND not found
D2 Pin15 -GND 31V (14V)

Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 7:57 AM

Post #10 of 56 (3435 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Yes, the quicking stops when desolder collector on transistor Q551.

jts1957
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Feb 25, 2018, 10:44 AM

Post #11 of 56 (3434 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

HOT likely bad. Test with Diode Test on meter. You must float the Base and/or Emitter otherwise you'll read the H.Drive transformer.

All I requested were the D Board Voltages.
So there is no confusion: Left column indicates measurement point to reference (TPD8 to COLD ground ... TPD9 to TPD11 ... C864 to COLD ground etc.)(ALL grounds for page 5 measurements are COLD grounds). Next columns I think you understand - Voltage reading expected (in a normally operating set) plus or minus how much.
With the exception of TPD8 (5VSB) which should be there whenever the TV is connected to AC Mains, Most of the rest require Main or Scan-derived voltage sources.

"The Power Supply Circuit contains a circuit area, which uses a separate power supply to isolate the earth connection.
The circuit is defined by HOT and COLD indications in the schematic diagram. All circuits, except the Power Circuit, are
COLD."
We will next want to take some voltage readings with reference to HOT ground:
TPD6 to HOT ground (SAME as 'across' C820).
Pin #4 of IC801 (SAME as 'across' C808).

Were voltages taken before or after Q551 Collector was floated? May or may not be helpful to remeasure D Board voltages if it was before?

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Location: Far, Far Away

Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 4:05 PM

Post #12 of 56 (3432 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

I was careful when grounding to HOT and COLD grounding not to damage instrument or something on PCB. The measurment was taken while ticking within 5 seconds because after 5 seconds TV goes back to standby, so i had to be very fast while measuring. While measuring everything was properly solder, transistor Q551 was completely solder, not floated.
I'll measure the rest.
TPD5 is HOT primary ground. Voltage meter is set to DC, everithing is solder on and measure is done while TV is quicking;
TPD5 cross TPD6 voltage is not constant it jumps 270-300V while TV is quicking.
TPD5 cross Pin4 of IC801 voltage is also not constan it jumps 10-15V while TV is quicking.

(This post was edited by Megatron on Feb 25, 2018, 6:08 PM)

Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 7:29 PM

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jts1957
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Feb 25, 2018, 9:20 PM

Post #14 of 56 (3417 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Quote

HOT likely bad. Test with Diode Test on meter. You must float the Base and/or Emitter otherwise you'll read the H.Drive transformer.

So was Q551 defective? And if so was it replaced?

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Megatron
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Feb 25, 2018, 11:24 PM

Post #15 of 56 (3415 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Now I have checked transistor Q551 and it is defective!I have desolder it from the PCB and tested with 6 way test with ohmmeter and it is leaking current in all 6 ways, it is shorted!

How did you know! Wow!

I haven't spare, need to buy in monday, today is closed. I'll let you know when I solder new one. I am going to check components around Q551 is it more else burned.

PS something is wrong with the forum server, it doesn't show new post, it shows only if you go through mail notification about new post or moderator is giving permit for issue.

(This post was edited by Megatron on Feb 25, 2018, 11:26 PM)

jts1957
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Feb 26, 2018, 12:02 AM

Post #16 of 56 (3413 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Refreshe - refreshe - refreshe.
Forward your forum complaint(s) to: http://www.tv-forums.com/...mmer;t=search_engine

If your plan is to keep slipping and shorting stuff, you may want to get more than one. Tongue

While Q551 is out, See if any D board voltages, including HOT ground two, are better.

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Location: Far, Far Away

Megatron
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Feb 26, 2018, 1:26 AM

Post #17 of 56 (3411 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Just found from some old desoldered TV stuff two transistors D2499, are they compatible with my burned Q551 Panasonic C5591 transistor (2SC5591)?

(This post was edited by Megatron on Feb 26, 2018, 1:37 AM)

jts1957
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Feb 26, 2018, 1:45 AM

Post #18 of 56 (3407 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

https://alltransistors.com/...hfe=6&caps=TOP3E

Older Panas used that number, but the two are not interchangeable.

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Megatron
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Feb 26, 2018, 1:55 AM

Post #19 of 56 (3405 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

I'l buy tomorow the new transistor.

In the mean time my solder station doesn't work well it doesn't heat enough Solomon SL-10. I have put new solder iron but it is the same problem. The transformer is very hot.
When i put slider to maximum it doesn't heat enough sometimes. I'll check transformer or tiristor BT136 is bad? Crazy

jts1957
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Feb 26, 2018, 3:03 AM

Post #20 of 56 (3403 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Did D board and HOT ground voltages return &/or stabilize? That's a third-time question.

The pencil is the most subject to abuse, followed by the wire lead, especially at strain relief & molded plug.
http://sc0ty.pl/...y-soldering-station/

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Location: Far, Far Away

(This post was edited by jts1957 on Feb 26, 2018, 3:13 AM)

Megatron
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Feb 26, 2018, 4:10 AM

Post #21 of 56 (3397 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

I have checked on solder station all transistors, capacitors ESR, diodes, resistors and found nothing and then I saw solder cracks on three pin connector which goes from transformer to PCB and that was the problem, cold solders. Solder station Works perfect now.

Between which points return&/or stabilize?

TPD5 is HOT primary ground. Voltage meter is set to DC, everithing is solder on and measure is done while TV is quicking;
TPD5 cross TPD6 voltage is not constant it jumps 270-300V while TV is quicking.
TPD5 cross Pin4 of IC801 voltage is also not constan it jumps 10-15V while TV is quicking.

All voltages drops to mV when stop quicking in standby mode.

jts1957
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Feb 26, 2018, 4:32 AM

Post #22 of 56 (3393 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

With the Q551 removed while you are awaiting a replacement ... Set does NOT click when defective transistor removed. Are D-Board voltages returned to normal? I'm curious to see if they try to come up - whether they 'stay' up or not.
D-board
TPD8-GND 7,5V (7,4V) OK
TPD9-TPD11 38,5V (7,1V)
TPD10-GND 15,5V (0,7V)
TPD13-GND 14,5V (2,5V)
TPD15-GND 144,8V (22V)
TPD32-GND 209V (18V)
C864-GND not found
D2 Pin15 -GND 31V (14V)

Are the previously not constant NOW constant with Q551 removed?
TPD6 to HOT ground (SAME as 'across' C820).
Pin #4 of IC801 (SAME as 'across' C808).

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Location: Far, Far Away

(This post was edited by jts1957 on Feb 26, 2018, 4:43 AM)

Megatron
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Feb 26, 2018, 5:38 AM

Post #23 of 56 (3389 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Now without defective transistor Q551:

When turn the TV on it clicks relay and hold for 5 seconds and shows constant voltage between HOT GROUND TPD5 an TPD6 299V and after 5 second relay release and drops on 9,5V in standby mode.

The same way between HOT GROUND TPD5 and Pin4 IC801 TV clicks relay on for 5 seconds and show constant voltage 15,7V and after 5 seconds relay release and drops to 8,5V in standby.

jts1957
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Feb 26, 2018, 7:32 AM

Post #24 of 56 (3376 views)
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Re: [Megatron] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

When turn the TV on it clicks relay and hold for 5 seconds and shows constant voltage between:
D-Board
TPD9-TPD11 38,5V (?V)
TPD10-GND 15,5V (?V)
TPD13-GND 14,5V (?V)
TPD15-GND 144,8V (?V)
TPD32-GND 209V (?V)
D2 Pin15 -GND 31V (?V)

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Location: Far, Far Away

Megatron
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Feb 26, 2018, 1:23 PM

Post #25 of 56 (3372 views)
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Re: [jts1957] CRT Panasonic TX-36PG50D tickting noise but not from relay [In reply to]	Can't Post

Something is very, very wrong with forum server. I have already write all new results of voltages before I went to sleep and the answer didn't appear on the forum. I'll write again:

D-board
TPD8-GND 7,5V (7,4V) OK
TPD9-TPD11 38,5V (38,1V)
TPD10-GND 15,5V (0,8V)
TPD13-GND 14,5V (11,8V)
TPD15-GND 144,8V (144,5V)
TPD32-GND 209V (143,7V)
C864-GND not found
D2 Pin15 -GND 31V (30,8V)

Who is the administrator of this forum, the server is the malfunctioning all the time! Frown

(This post was edited by Megatron on Feb 26, 2018, 1:29 PM)

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